Curse

Missing HB · Jan 21, 2012, 09:34 AM // 09:34

Seems to be a good update as long as onslaught and blinding flash are changed

However, i wonder if so many skill updates are really needed in PvP, it's not like there will be a sudden massive increase of players there as a result of it..

Leohan · Jan 21, 2012, 02:07 PM // 14:07

Quote:

* Wild Throw: added the following functionality: “All of your non-spear attack skills are disabled for 3 seconds”

We’ve seen many Warriors taking this skill without investment in Spear Mastery in order to remove stances. Despite how innovative this is, we feel that this type of skill should require investment in Spear Mastery to be effective, but don’t want to link it to Leadership lest it take away from legitimate A/P or R/P builds. The disable time will make it less appealing to builds utilizing weapon swaps, but keep it viable on dedicated spear builds.

Um ok what happens if I am a Imbagon/damage reduction paragon and like to help out my team by taking Wild Throw? But Assassins and Rangers with dedicated Spear Builds won't be hurt? Umm ok.
The fail on less than 4-5 spear mastery sounds like a better plan to me than, making a Imba's build dead.

I know , I know, just don't take the skill. I just find this is the wrong way to change this skill because another class uses it, with no commitment to the attribute. I am talking about PvP and PvE. Yes I use a paragon in PvP.

Edited for a thought after wards:
The skill is called "Wild Throw" adding a fail to hit mechanic would not be to much of a stretch even from a lore perspective.

Skill Description:
"Spear Attack. If this attack hits, it deals +5...17...20 damage and any stance being used by your target ends. This attack cannot be blocked. (50% failure chance with Spear Mastery 4 or less.)"

keli · Jan 21, 2012, 02:48 PM // 14:48

^Make it 9 and it's ok. On the other hand I don't know if we really need that much Dervish nerf.

DiogoSilva · Jan 21, 2012, 03:32 PM // 15:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leohan

Um ok what happens if I am a Imbagon/damage reduction paragon and like to help out my team by taking Wild Throw?

Nothing. Unless you're taking a sword, axe, hammer, dagger, bow or scythe, nothing happens. Take note that this only reacharges non-spear attack skills.

Quote:

But Assassins and Rangers with dedicated Spear Builds won't be hurt? Umm ok.

Much like how Paragons with dedicated Spear builds won't be affected.

Quote:

The fail on less than 4-5 spear mastery sounds like a better plan to me than

The balancing team considered that, but it wouldn't do a thing, because Hammer Warriors only invest in Strength/ Hammer mastery attributes, so it would be easy for them to get up to 5 or even 8 Spear Mastery points with little to no sacrifice. (This information is on the Discussion page of the linked wiki skill preview.)

Edit: If anything, by using your Paragon for PvP and take with you Wild Throw, you'll be slightly more relevant because Hammer warriors won't have it anymore - and they'll need it.

AmoebaInfectionTechnique · Jan 21, 2012, 05:27 PM // 17:27

"The disable time will make it less appealing to builds utilizing weapon swaps, but keep it viable on dedicated spear builds. "

It's explicitly stated in the blog.

DiogoSilva · Jan 21, 2012, 08:31 PM // 20:31

Spirit Bond's change is both for PvE and PvP. The original text said otherwise, but it has been corrected by them now.

*lemming* · Jan 21, 2012, 08:44 PM // 20:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunder

One has to be impressed that the combo went so long before people started exploiting it though. Obviously the meta game still goes on in some form.

Well, it also took them a year and a half to nerf it.

Also, in the interests of promoting better discussion: http://www.teamquitter.com/viewtopic.php?f=128&t=28125

Ayuhmii Shanbwa · Jan 21, 2012, 08:48 PM // 20:48

whoops, my bad, i didnt read well as i was tired at the time
but doesnt change the fact i'd like to see 100% pve/pvp splits

i didnt even know about builds which require that 1 spear skill and the rest other attack skills o_O
(i use own made builds)

i read "skills" instead of "attack skills"

well anyway, i think they shouldnt be in a rush with either changing stuff or release such info, until they know for sure its good

this list doesnt look bad, although that monk skill could use a split imo, as i dont see any problems with it as it is atm in pve, but its not that much of a problem to me

i still have faith in anet, even after GW2 for GW

Coast · Jan 21, 2012, 09:06 PM // 21:06

most of these changes seem nice, maybe they could added aos and b stance nerf too tho(like max 2 kd's prevented or so)

Malganis · Jan 21, 2012, 09:50 PM // 21:50

I'm glad to see Onslaught getting a slight nerf. I'm still surprised that Dervishes have such easy, maintainable IAS, while Warriors' & Paragons' IAS comes with drawbacks such as taking double damage or -20 armor. I dont even play a warrior character and I think its unfair.

DiogoSilva · Jan 22, 2012, 01:04 PM // 13:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malganis

I'm glad to see Onslaught getting a slight nerf. I'm still surprised that Dervishes have such easy, maintainable IAS, while Warriors' & Paragons' IAS comes with drawbacks such as taking double damage or -20 armor. I dont even play a warrior character and I think its unfair.

I guess being strippable, and requiring another enchantment to be maintanable, balances it out.

Axel Zinfandel · Jan 22, 2012, 06:29 PM // 18:29

Guys, just throwing this out here, but most PvE paragons only use two attack skills. three at most. Few people run spear chucking builds in PvE. So yes, this affects PvE paragons a good deal. Another very unnecessary nerf.

Outerworld · Jan 22, 2012, 06:38 PM // 18:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel

Guys, just throwing this out here, but most PvE paragons only use two attack skills. three at most. Few people run spear chucking builds in PvE. So yes, this affects PvE paragons a good deal. Another very unnecessary nerf.

It will only affect non-spear attack skills.

jazilla · Jan 22, 2012, 09:01 PM // 21:01

Kinda stoked on these changes. Really glad SS didn't take a hit. I am still enjoying my Double Dragon build atm though, but I will have to play with some of this stuff once it goes live.

MithranArkanere · Jan 23, 2012, 12:27 AM // 00:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel

Guys, just throwing this out here, but most PvE paragons only use two attack skills. three at most. Few people run spear chucking builds in PvE. So yes, this affects PvE paragons a good deal. Another very unnecessary nerf.

Not it doesn't. Paragons do not have melee attacks. Even Spear Swipe is a Spear attack even though it has melee range.

The change will only affect non-spear attacks. This means warriors can't use it as effectively instead their own stance removals without going fully spear.

I'm feeling a bit bad for warriors, though. I've never been killed by a warrior in PvP, ever, regardless of the profession I was using. They can do some stuff, but they feel like they can't do half the stuff others can, and others can do anything warriors can.

Xenomortis · Jan 23, 2012, 12:55 AM // 00:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

and others can do anything warriors can.

No, they can't. They really cannot.

Seriously, in the entire history of this game, only one other profession has really put itself in competition with the Warrior, and even that hasn't been continuous.

Swingline · Jan 23, 2012, 04:13 AM // 04:13

The Warriors low standing today is a product of massive power creep. He must rely on secondary profession skills and others to cleanse the all too common Blind condition and also knockdown chains to effectively kill enemy healers... woops the monk just used b stance.

PvE is where the Warrior needs the most attention. His damage has been pitiful ever since the AS nerf and hes been reduced to defy pain tanking, but then again a SF sin can tank better. To do any real damage he must have a support profession with S&H, Splinter and/or Orders.

Malganis · Jan 23, 2012, 07:52 AM // 07:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiogoSilva

I guess being strippable, and requiring another enchantment to be maintanable, balances it out.

6 points in Wind Prayers + any weapon of enchanting makes it maintainable with ease. I run it on all my warrior heroes. They dont seem to cast it immediately on recharge, though, but close enough.

Killed u man · Jan 23, 2012, 01:33 PM // 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swingline

PvE is where the Warrior needs the most attention. His damage has been pitiful ever since the AS nerf and hes been reduced to defy pain tanking, but then again a SF sin can tank better. To do any real damage he must have a support profession with S&H, Splinter and/or Orders.

Yeah, but that damage outclasses pretty much every other damage out there. I alone, as a warrior, can kill 2 groups in Slaver's HM with no more than handfull of hits.

It's obviously kinda "sad" that the Warrior class in PvE relies on buffs from other professions, but the same can be said about most classes. Look at Monks. Where would Monks be if they weren't allowed to take other professions in their teambuild, same said for mesmers.

I would focus more on the actual problem classes, which are still the Paragon and the Ranger.

jazilla · Jan 23, 2012, 01:43 PM // 13:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

I would focus more on the actual problem classes, which are still the Paragon and the Ranger.

I agree. I want to see ranger spirit cast times reduced in PvE to the same levels as rit spirits. I would also like to see traps get damage nerfs and cast times reduced so that they are usable in fights and not as gimmick builds.

I would love to see the Motivation line get some love in PvE. It would be great to see it reverted to its initial release state and split from PvP which I think it should have been when they introduced PvP/Pve splits and inexplicably wasn't.

I am posting this after they announced that GW2 is confirmed for release this year, so it needs love NOW. I don't see myself jumping in GW1 after GW2 is released except to see what my b-day presents are.